Zoe Kravitz and Matt Reeves

When Zoë Kravitz first met Matt Reeves about playing Selina Kyle, aka Catwoman, alongside Robert Pattinson in “The Batman,” she had two years to write what would become her directorial debut. Born from Kravitz’s “rage toward men in power,” “Blink Twice” — retitled the original “Pussy Island” for obvious reasons — follows Frida (Naomi Ackie) as she falls into the orbit of tech billionaire Slater King (Channing Tatum). and is taken to his private island, where the opulent, endless party atmosphere hides a much more menacing reality. A few months after the film’s summer release, Reeves sits down with Kravitz, armed with questions for the actor-turned-filmmaker about his experience behind the camera. Kravitz also gets his former and future director to talk about his process — and shares updates on “The Batman Part II” and the future of HBO’s Reeves-produced spinoff “The Penguin.”

Zoe Kravitz: I remember our first meeting. I came to your office and you told me about “The Batman.” You asked me not to read the script yet, because you wanted to introduce me to the world, show me visuals and tell me about your references.

Matt Reeves: Wait, but we met again, is that true? Because I don’t remember the first meeting. In the second meeting you came in with all these amazing ideas – that’s what I remember.

Kravitz: I did it. I then read the script and it was very helpful to know in advance what you were going to do.

Reeves: You were talking about the idea of ​​her collecting stray animals. I was like, “I love this idea, but I don’t know how we’re ever going to incorporate this line.” And you say, “Oh, it’s so simple. Just ask him to look at the cats and say, “I have a lot of cats.” » This is one of my favorite moments in the film. So it doesn’t surprise me that you did such an incredible job with your first film, because the ideas you came up with were just clever. Did you always know you wanted to direct?

Kravitz: No, I don’t think I even allowed myself to admit that this was something I wanted to do. Especially as a woman, when you’re into movies, people say, “Oh, cutie, you should be an actress.” » No one says, “Little girl, do you like movies?” You should be a director. But when I’m on set, I’m always watching and learning.

Reeves: That’s what I remember. We were both looking for this thing – you were someone I could say, “Let’s look at the monitor.” Let’s look for the moment.

Kravitz: You actually turned my world upside down with this idea. You invited me to participate in the process. Concretely, Selina is such a physical role and I was able to get away from the anxiety of looking at myself. I would notice things that I thought no one else would notice, and then you would come and talk about that exact thing, and it made me feel less crazy. You are an incredibly meticulous filmmaker. I just asked you how things are going with the writing (“Part II”) and you said “Slow” and I think that’s a wonderful quality, because you care so much.

Reeves: It’s wonderful, except how quickly something gets accomplished. The thing is, for me, I feel like it’s not a choice. I always feel like I would never do it the way I do it, except it’s the only way I know how. The metaphor I use when talking to my partners is that writing and directing a film is like being in a dark room. Everything you need is in the room, but there’s no light and you’re on all fours. And when something connects, you go, “Oh, that’s something.” »

Kravitz: Yes! And that leads to something else.

Reeves: I did an episode of “Homicide: Life on the Streets.” I was about to do “Felicity” and I was like, “I better figure out how to make television.” On the third day, I said to myself, “I don’t think I can have a career if I use this much energy look.” I put so much energy into “Is this good yet?” Does it work? I realized I couldn’t possibly know the answer, but just know that I don’t yet.

Kravitz: What do you think of the casting? Especially when you’re making a superhero film where there have been so many other versions.

Reeves: I had to find a personal path in Batman and then think about how someone could bring something personal to me. You’re always looking for an inner life that’s going to take what this story is and make us feel like you have insight into this person’s struggle. It’s weird: to be completely honest, when I was writing, I was thinking about Rob.

Kravitz: Has this occurred to you?

Reeves: Well, I just started thinking about Princess Diana’s children and the idea of ​​being this orphan prince. For some reason, I don’t know why, it made me relate to Kurt Cobain. And then somewhere in there, someone told me to watch (the 2017 Robert Pattinson film) “Good Time.” And I was like, “He’s the only person I could imagine as this Batman.” I don’t think I know what it is if it’s not him. It was a strange fate, as it turned out he was obsessed with Batman.

How did you arrive at your casting?

Kravitz: Channing was the first person I thought of for Slater King, and I don’t know where that came from, like you. I knew the character had to be someone we think we can trust, especially because we don’t believe Naomi is getting on that plane if it’s someone who is immediately insidious. I wanted to use his charisma as a weapon. We’ve never seen him do anything like this.

And then with Naomi, I knew I needed someone’s face to be so expressive, because a big part of that character is that her face says one thing and her eyes say another, and it’s a difficult thing to do. We had a meeting. I had seen enough of her work where I knew she was capable. She basically understood what the movie was about.

Reeves: I think of the filming period as a hunting-gathering period, and when you’re done, you rewrite again in editing. How did the editing go for you?

Kravitz: Oh, my God, I was in editing for almost two years. I’ve been warned, you’re watching your edit and you’re just ready to…

Reeves: You want to kill yourself.

Kravitz: I wanted to put myself in the trash. It was really hard. It didn’t work for very long.

Reeves: What struck you about what didn’t work?

Kravitz: The story was felt everywhere. There was a lack of tension. Because I have so many characters that you don’t know who to connect to and who to follow. I realized that the more you try to control a film and make it what you think it is, the worse it will be. It’s like having a kid and saying, “You’re going to be straight and a doctor and live in Connecticut.” » You must allow him to show you what he wants to be. Once I let that go and listened to it, everything really came together. But you have to let your idea die.

Reeves: Do you think the main thing is what you were looking for all along?

Kravitz: Actually, I think it ended up being closer to what I wanted, but I haven’t figured it out yet or anything like that. I also had this incredible blessing that everyone wore the same thing every day. So I realized it was like documentary footage. I can just rip this apart, and I did.

Reeves: How did you start rebuilding it?

Kravitz: There were many different versions. I was very lucky, because we had finished the film – it still wasn’t working, but it was time to stop – and then the strike happened. So I had this pause, and I realized that I had completely lost perspective. I took a step back and watched some of my favorite movies and kind of let go for a second. I told my editor, “Don’t tell the studio, but I’m going to restructure the whole movie.” »

Reeves: You want to keep doing that, obviously. What do you think is next?

Kravitz: I do. I love him. Thrillers have always been what interested me, but part of me is like, “I should just do a romantic comedy and see what happens.” »And you’re writing (“The Batman Part II”) at the moment?

Reeves: Yeah, we’re finishing the script. We’re going to tour next year.

Kravitz: And other of these shows? Everyone is freaking out about “The Penguin.”

Reeves: Yeah, we’re talking to (showrunner) Lauren (LeFranc) about doing another season. It was a special experience. I feel really lucky. These characters do not belong to me; they belong to the world. It’s about whether you can approach them in a way that expresses something personal.

Kravitz: I think that’s why the marriage between you and Batman right now is such an incredible combination. You have this ability to work with advanced ideas. They all feel so human and so grounded. And that’s a very difficult thing to do.